Cryto! 24 July 2013
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01:48:37 <lady-3jane> oh wow
01:48:45 <lady-3jane> no wonder everyone's jumping ship from berkelydb
01:48:57 <lady-3jane> oracle relicensed it from bsd to agplv3
01:49:03 <lady-3jane> eeeeek
01:50:25 <lady-3jane> also oracle
01:50:27 <lady-3jane> >_>
02:09:47 <ElectRo`> the touch of death
02:09:58 <ElectRo`> cisco is starting follow suit too :(
02:10:24 <ElectRo`> SNORT FORK IN 3.2.1..
02:11:59 <maddux> oh god
02:12:03 <maddux> i am so happy
02:12:24 <maddux> i fail to recognize it
02:12:28 <maddux> and appreciate it :(
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02:42:07 <lady-3jane> I wonder if there's a license that is halfway between
02:42:30 <lady-3jane> as free as bsd/mit but forces all subsequent versions to be under that free license
02:42:30 <lady-3jane> lol
02:42:58 <lady-3jane> you, forcibly, can do anything you want with it
02:42:59 <lady-3jane> lulz
02:43:12 * lady-3jane giggles
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08:44:40 <iceTwy> Hola
09:50:34 <swordy> Whola
09:50:50 <swordy> em, http://ubuntuforums.org/announce.html hoaxd
09:53:37 <iceTwy> ya we know
09:54:07 <iceTwy> salted MD5 hashes
09:54:08 <iceTwy> Ubuntu
09:54:09 <iceTwy> seriously
09:54:17 <swordy> xd
09:54:37 <iceTwy> even my mom could encrypt passwords better than that
09:54:40 <iceTwy> is it so hard? pft
09:57:11 <swordy> if so i really liek ya mom :)
09:57:33 <iceTwy> lmao
09:57:35 <iceTwy> well no
09:57:43 <iceTwy> she still uses IE8 on her work PC
09:57:47 <iceTwy> work laptop rathert
09:57:49 <iceTwy> rather*
09:58:45 <joepie91> iceTwy: where does it say md5?
09:59:18 <swordy> joepie91, gr33tings fellow anon
10:00:14 <swordy> you well? is all fine? you got your pc back?
10:00:15 * joepie91 points at topic
10:00:20 <joepie91> not yet, no
10:00:34 <joepie91> and I'm currently not terribly great due to a combination of circumstances
10:00:36 * swordy <- not violating topic, just sayin
10:01:50 <swordy> okay, maybe its cause you host smthng for anonnews, isnt?
10:01:57 <joepie91> no
10:02:36 <iceTwy> joepie91: they said it earlier
10:02:57 <swordy> write a blog post about it, its for the people behind you
10:03:02 <joepie91> iceTwy: ?
10:03:03 <joepie91> oh
10:03:05 <joepie91> the md5 thing?
10:03:08 <iceTwy> yeah
10:03:13 <iceTwy> Ars Technica post I believe
10:03:14 <joepie91> weren't they using vBulletin or some shit
10:03:25 <iceTwy> http://arstechnica.com/security/2013/07/hack-exposes-e-mail-addresses-password-data-for-2-million-ubuntu-forum-users/
10:03:27 <iceTwy> yes they were
10:03:28 <iceTwy> lol
10:03:33 <swordy> in the newspaper i read that some russian guy came free for writing his blog... etcetera
10:03:36 <iceTwy> 2 million users and vBulletin
10:03:36 <joepie91> then it's standard shitty vBulletin pw hashing
10:03:37 <iceTwy> seriously
10:03:44 <iceTwy> how irresponsible is that
10:04:02 <iceTwy> if they did get hacked through a SQLi
10:04:03 <joepie91> iceTwy; not quite sure what usercount and 'vBulletin' have to do with each other...?
10:04:11 <iceTwy> no
10:04:14 <iceTwy> the encryption, that is
10:04:27 <joepie91> I don't think you have a choice
10:04:27 <iceTwy> oh did I say vBulletin
10:04:30 <joepie91> when using vBulletin
10:04:36 <iceTwy> you should :|
10:05:11 <joepie91> yet every time I point out how vBulletin, IPB, etc. are terrible
10:05:15 <joepie91> people start bitching at me
10:06:06 <iceTwy> I think that Ars has become my favorite news source
10:06:07 <iceTwy> really
10:09:33 <joepie91> http://arstechnica.com/security/2013/07/vibers-online-help-desk-sacked-by-pro-syrian-hackers/
10:09:36 <joepie91> this is curious
10:09:48 <joepie91> "We weren't able to hack all Viber systems, but most of it is designed for spying and tracking," the SEA wrote of the Israel-based company on its support.viber.com subdomain.
10:10:09 <joepie91> this is a conclusion I'd come to from cursory research on them already.... but I didn't expect something like the SEA to use it as an argument
10:11:57 <iceTwy> Viber...
10:12:05 <iceTwy> isn't it this IM phone app?
10:12:07 <joepie91> (context: Viber is from the same guys that publish all the fake-P2P-application malware bundles, TorchBrowser, iLivid, and so on... iMesh/Bandoo/Discordia basically)
10:12:09 <joepie91> yes
10:12:35 <joepie91> search around a bit for Bandoo Media, Discordia Ltd. and iMesh
10:12:41 <joepie91> and you'll find plenty of dirt
10:13:00 <joepie91> they're not very good at covering their tracks, not even with the good amount of shell companies they've set up
10:13:18 <iceTwy> duh
10:13:21 <swordy> k5day old news... but for completing my thoughts of navalny http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/newsdesk/2013/07/alexey-navalny-a-free-man-in-russia.html
10:13:25 <joepie91> iceTwy: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shareaza#Domain_takeover
10:13:27 <iceTwy> though Viber's pretty popular I hear
10:13:29 <joepie91> also Bandoo/iMesh
10:14:17 <joepie91> yes, Viber is pretty popular
10:14:19 <joepie91> that's part of the problem
10:15:06 <joepie91> they also own iLivid, Torch Browser, FixBee, and closely related to Babylon (that translation software)
10:15:21 <joepie91> and like 10-20 other pieces of software
10:15:28 <iceTwy> "Viber Media is a Cypriot-based company[1] with development centers in Belarus[2] and Israel.[3] The company was founded by the American-Israeli entrepreneur Talmon Marco, co-founder and former president of the P2P media and file-sharing client iMesh.[4]"
10:15:34 <iceTwy> 200 million people use Viber
10:15:35 <iceTwy> ...
10:15:39 <joepie91> they also ship fake clients pretending to be Shareaza, iMesh, or Lphant
10:15:45 <joepie91> bundled with malware
10:15:53 <joepie91> yeah, they're not Cypriot
10:15:55 <joepie91> that's just a shell company
10:15:59 <joepie91> they're Israelian
10:16:16 <joepie91> they have a bunch of Cypriot shells, also one in Panama i think
10:16:17 <joepie91> I*
10:16:19 <joepie91> and one in the US
10:16:23 <joepie91> (from memory)
10:17:31 <iceTwy> tsst
10:43:42 <botpie91> 04FichteFoll made 3 commit(s) to 03package_control_channel on branch 10master: '02Adds repository to helper plugin for CanISwitchToSublimeText3.com', '02Woops... Better not break the json', '02Merge pull request #1553 from SublimeGit/masterAdds repository to helper plugin for CanISwitchToSublimeText3.com' (https://github.com/wbond/package_control_channel/compare/48ebac75f8...ecd6d91735)
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10:57:37 <iceTwy> wtf thumbnails?
10:57:42 <iceTwy> they're taking like, 700Mb on my SDD
11:30:34 <iceTwy> also
11:30:41 <iceTwy> is shred useless on ext4 filesystems?
11:31:11 <iceTwy> since it's a journaling file system either way
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12:43:16 <monod> don't know WHY, but it's possible to use IRC with Konversation, from where I am now.
12:43:22 <monod> hello everybodiez
12:47:27 <MK_FG> iceTwy, Why should journaling make shred useless?
12:47:47 <MK_FG> Copy-on-write (e.g. btrfs, zfs) should, but why journal?
13:03:15 <monod> this: http://hackingteam.it/ and this: http://hackingteam.it/index.php/remote-control-system
13:12:18 <botpie91> 04FichteFoll made 2 commit(s) to 03package_control_channel on branch 10master: '02Update repositories.json', '02Merge pull request #1555 from webArtisan/master[lessTabs] new package : Update repositories.json' (https://github.com/wbond/package_control_channel/compare/ecd6d91735...de1d21ccf3)
13:12:19 <monod> can I denounce these guys? ^
13:13:10 <monod> I mean: of course I can do it, but.. is it going to be taken into consideration by law enforcers?
13:13:19 <monod> or advocates.
13:13:48 <monod> if I go offline, answer it anyway, I'll read logs lates
13:13:51 <monod> later*
13:26:34 <monod> do you imagine publishing an MD5 hash list claiming it has been leaked from somewhere secret and challenging crackers team around the globe to crack it? While the hash list has been generated with words purposedly 1) not present in dictionaries and 2) not reached by "common" "scrambling" rules, like base64.rule and others... xD
13:26:44 <monod> biggest troll ever for crackers xD
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13:29:39 <monod> buuzy men
13:34:37 <MK_FG> I imagine such deliberately-constructed lists should be easy to detect by the fact that md5-hashed word "password" doesn't work for some 30% of accounts ;)
13:34:56 <MK_FG> Everyun knows that's THE password ;)
13:39:06 <monod> I think the real deception is when you feel you NEED those services that ask you for a password to provide you with a personal account. That's the only time when someone is really running a risk, because websites do not safely store password contraryly of what they say. So, for not risking, don't use passwords. "But how can you do so if you need to?". The answer is: do you REALLY NEED those services? The world is turning into the direction in which
13:39:07 <monod> we NEED these things, this is wrong in my opinion. joepie91, I think you may enjoy thinking about this, it may help you with your thoughts and add a little bit of creativity? MK_FG: yeah, yet do you imagine the faces? xDD The "prhoh" crackerz trying to fuse their 25-computer cloud in the intent of cracking those cursed hashes?? :D
13:39:12 <monod> it would turn hilarious xDDD
13:39:18 <monod> I would definitely try.
13:49:04 <MK_FG> Nah, there are several wrong assumptions about people who crack these, I think
13:49:31 <MK_FG> You know that simple old-dumps dectionary should crack 90% of db in first minutes
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13:49:46 <MK_FG> So if it's not the case at all, clearly you're dealing with garbage
13:50:14 <MK_FG> ...or different hashing schema than advertised
13:51:47 <MK_FG> If there's nothing obvious working with these dicts, I don't think someone would care enough to waste time or money on such no-idea-where-it-came-from dump and rather assume the obvious "it's just /dev/urandom output"
13:52:14 <MK_FG> And if there're also logins/email, there should be much easier ways to confirm that it's garbage
13:52:34 <MK_FG> Also, I don't see why you hate passwords so much
13:52:57 <MK_FG> I mean, generate random string for each site and keep it, what risk is there?
13:53:52 <MK_FG> If site's hacked, naturally you can consider your account there compromised - whole site might be, all data there might be, and oh god - your random string too - big deal ;)
14:01:22 <joepie91> wtf is with the Lidl changing their products lately
14:01:49 <joepie91> <MK_FG>I mean, generate random string for each site and keep it, what risk is there?
14:01:50 <joepie91> pubkey auth!
14:02:03 <joepie91> monod: just add in hashes of common passwords at a reasonable frequency
14:02:08 <MK_FG> Sure, there are even better ways
14:02:45 <MK_FG> But when you allow users to use pubkeys, users will re-use them same as passwords
14:03:01 <MK_FG> And will leak their private keys all over the place too, probably ;)
14:03:33 <MK_FG> Still, imho harder to do that if you make distinction "public" - "private" clear enough
14:03:59 <MK_FG> (personally, I'd like everyone to use smartcards, where users can't get privkeys!)
14:04:21 <MK_FG> (and hopefully nsa neither)
14:05:07 <joepie91> new Lidl cheese is awesome
14:05:31 <joepie91> MK_FG: if everything is automated, there's no point in worrying about lost privkeys
14:05:39 <joepie91> think keyring
14:06:36 <MK_FG> I think of them as software smartcards ;)
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14:19:40 <monod> maybe, instead of a wordlist with no common passwords at all, we could let them crack the easy ones, like 'password', 'letmein' or '123456', for a good 30%, and after that put some really-hard-to-guess passwords. I think you could also fill up to a 50% with common passwords, just to PRETEND it's a legit hash list xDD.. anyway, "<MK_FG> Also, I don't see why you hate passwords so much": the point of my argument was different, I said something more
14:19:40 <monod> like this: we think we NEED certain services, that store sensitive informations of ours, secured with passwords, but even if those passwords are not stores in plaintext, the methods widely used around are close to plaintext in safety, when the passwords are not strong enough. So we put in many others' hands our things and our passwords without a minimum DECENCY regarding the password storing. This is also what I wanted to say to joepie91, more or
14:19:42 <monod> less. I did not understand: "<joepie91> monod: just add in hashes of common passwords at a reasonable frequency"
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14:29:34 <zxcvbnm> I think the solution is simple. Password + 2 factor authentication
14:29:42 <joepie91> monod: I meant what you just said
14:29:53 <joepie91> create a wordlist with common passwords like every other list
14:29:57 <joepie91> then filling up the rest with nonsense
14:30:27 <MK_FG> monod, Yeah, true, biz don't generally care about your data if you aren't paying them for it
14:36:01 <monod> hm..
14:38:02 <monod> So I have to get read of money, that is: I have to finish the mary-book.pdf
14:38:30 <joepie91> MK_FG: if you aren't giving them financial compensation for it *
14:38:33 <joepie91> and even if you are
14:38:36 <joepie91> they still don't care
14:38:41 <joepie91> beyond not killing their own income stream
14:38:51 <joepie91> (generally)
14:39:52 <mama> ebola!!
14:39:57 <MK_FG> Heh, guess so, they won't exactly care about *that* either way
14:40:06 <ebola> mama how you?
14:40:15 <MK_FG> Just about not pissing you off enough with their sloppiness
14:40:37 <mama> missing you ebola; let's pm ;)
14:41:02 <MK_FG> And I think "they" here means me as well
14:41:03 <monod> ^ love story
14:42:01 <joepie91> s/love/sex/
14:42:49 * zxcvbnm gasps
14:42:52 <zxcvbnm> The debauchery!!
14:43:52 <joepie91> ... is it bad that I can recognize theme park / funfair rides as being manufactured by Huss just from watching a video?
14:43:58 * joepie91 frowns
14:47:23 <MK_FG> What?
14:47:28 <MK_FG> :))
14:48:16 <joepie91> MK_FG: Huss is a ride manufacturer
14:48:19 <monod> hahahaha <joepie91> s/love/sex/
14:48:24 <joepie91> I can recognize their rides from looking at a video of them
14:48:30 <joepie91> because they... work in a somewhat particular way
14:48:39 <joepie91> and I'm not sure whether this is a good or a bad thing
14:49:08 <joepie91> (also, I have somewhat of a soft spot for their rides... generally low degrees of headache, and very fun/fast)
14:49:28 <monod> headache incoming, have to go.
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14:51:09 <joepie91> example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kh_9VRgjctw&hd=1
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15:56:37 <monod> hi, I had to pass to post this:
15:56:48 <monod> http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2008/sep/29/cloud.computing.richard.stallman
15:57:12 <monod> In particular: "The growing number of people storing information on internet-accessible servers rather than on their own machines, has become a core part of the rise of Web 2.0 applications. Millions of people now upload personal data such as emails, photographs and, increasingly, their work, to sites owned by companies such as Google."
15:58:27 <monod> does an open cloud system exist? or even does it have sense?
15:58:48 <monod> I mean: something running only free and open source software
15:58:52 <joepie91> monod: it's called the internet
15:58:53 <joepie91> ;)
16:00:54 <monod> hmm.. I don't get, as well as because I don't properly understand the topic yet
16:01:12 <monod> as a plus, in minutes I will have to go catch the hecking trainz
16:01:20 <monod> headache still hammering
16:01:32 <monod> psychologist taking summer vacations
16:01:32 <joepie91> monod: "cloud" is a buzzword
16:01:35 <joepie91> it doesn't have a real meaning
16:01:55 <monod> I thought you meant the open and free cloud was "internet"
16:01:55 <ryan_> cloud
16:01:57 <ryan_> is a thing
16:01:59 <ryan_> on the sky
16:02:05 <joepie91> I should've clarified
16:02:08 <ryan_> its made of
16:02:09 <joepie91> it doesn't have a real meaning on the internet*
16:02:10 <joepie91> :p
16:02:15 <joepie91> monod: it is
16:02:29 <joepie91> 'cloud' basically refers to anything internet-y that someone wants to sound more cool
16:02:49 <joepie91> hell, for as long as I can remember, "the internet" was drawn in a cloud on network schematics
16:03:00 <ryan_> water
16:03:00 <ryan_> and sometimes some other gases
16:03:03 <joepie91> if you want an 'open cloud', just look at the internet as a whole
16:03:11 <monod> okay
16:03:31 <monod> I have a bit of difficulty expressing right now/today
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16:17:23 <monod> good bye guyzzzz, trainzzz awaiingzzz
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16:50:33 <lady-3jane> also openstack counts as open cloud
16:51:02 <lady-3jane> if you want to talk about a distributed computing software platform to be run in usually someone else's datacenter
16:51:14 <lady-3jane> :3
16:51:34 <lady-3jane> anybody use pybitmessage?
16:51:48 <lady-3jane> Oh I suppose it's just called bitmessage
16:57:06 <lady-3jane> NP: [Os Mutantes - Panis Et Circensis] [Tropicália ou Panis et Circencis] [922kbps] DeaDBeeF 0.5.6-3jane
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17:17:35 <anonanon> Hello
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17:20:03 <iceTwy> clearly this guy is a rhythm guitarist
17:20:09 <iceTwy> so why does he have a 7-string guitar?
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18:13:59 * lady-3jane bounces
18:14:20 <lady-3jane> I fixed images from *.files.wordpress.com
18:14:46 <lady-3jane> they serve from a 192.x address, and I had clipped that entire block in my dns config
18:15:00 <lady-3jane> turns out it's just part of that block
18:15:04 <lady-3jane> :>
18:15:51 <joepie91> reminds me of the hamachi drama
18:15:56 <joepie91> when OVH started handing out 5.x.x.x blocks
18:15:57 <joepie91> lol
18:22:13 <lady-3jane> hahaha
18:23:48 <joepie91> you can imagine the clusterfuck that ensued
18:24:29 <joepie91> it kind of sucks when you get a 100 eur/mo box at OVH to run game servers off
18:24:38 <joepie91> and then get half your players complaining that they "can't connect"
18:25:48 <lady-3jane> It's not ovh's fault hamachi announces into a nonprivate block
18:25:49 <lady-3jane> lol
18:29:34 <joepie91> indeed
18:29:38 <joepie91> which is what the whole drama was about
18:29:40 <joepie91> :P
18:30:03 <lady-3jane> If they were going to be cunts they could run >240/8
18:30:36 <lady-3jane> I think 240/4 isn't assigned yet
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19:22:24 <ElectRo`> dont know whats worse
19:22:31 <ElectRo`> scratch lottery or pull tabs
19:22:39 <joepie91> http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-57595086-93/sec-accuses-texas-man-of-running-bitcoin-ponzi-scheme/
19:22:41 <joepie91> classy
19:22:47 <joepie91> looks like they caught up with the Pirate guy
19:23:21 <ElectRo`> not thee dreaded pirate
19:23:28 <joepie91> pirateat40
19:28:12 <why_slap_option> hi
19:29:08 <why_slap_option> brb
19:30:51 <why_slap_option> back
19:53:32 <joepie91> pear juice!
19:59:41 <why_slap_option> hey
20:02:34 <lady-3jane> om nom nom
20:04:19 <joepie91> om nom nom indeed
20:04:22 <joepie91> the Lidl pear juice is particularly good
20:04:28 <joepie91> actually, the Lidl juices in general are good
20:04:38 <joepie91> only their multi-vitamin I'm not terribly excited about, a bit too watery
20:04:58 <joepie91> these are processed juices though, not fresh
20:10:59 <lady-3jane> huh
20:11:51 <lady-3jane> google tells me it's awesome for brewing too
20:11:52 <lady-3jane> :>
20:13:35 <iceTwy> oh
20:13:40 <iceTwy> fruit juices
20:14:01 <iceTwy> that remind me of famous fruit juice companies' hard lobbying to promote drinking fruit juices at breakfast
20:14:30 <iceTwy> in pretty much every state-funded ad about kids' nutrition (at least here) they say that kids must drink orange juice, preferably
20:14:53 <iceTwy> when scientists have shown that there's no - up to my knowledge - significant advantage
20:15:08 <iceTwy> cc joepie91 ^
20:15:45 <joepie91> mhmm
20:15:48 <joepie91> I just like fruit juices
20:16:05 <joepie91> and they're relatively healthy for me considering I don't eat much fruit
20:16:05 <joepie91> :p
20:16:14 <joepie91> and generally my nutrition isn't great
20:16:18 <iceTwy> d'aw
20:16:21 <iceTwy> y u no veggies joepie91
20:16:43 <joepie91> because expensive
20:16:49 <iceTwy> that's true
20:16:54 <iceTwy> it's outrageous tbh
20:17:03 <iceTwy> processed, crappy industrial food with shit-tier quality aliments
20:17:06 <iceTwy> (literally, SHIT tier)
20:17:14 <joepie91> iceTwy, pm
20:17:16 <iceTwy> are the less expensive things you can find out there
20:17:20 <joepie91> and yup
20:24:14 <iceTwy> where's
20:24:15 <iceTwy> lady-3jane:
20:26:19 <lady-3jane> iceTwy:) what
20:26:27 <iceTwy> Interesting tweet lady-3jane
20:26:39 <lady-3jane> my accidental one I suppose, but yes
20:26:47 <iceTwy> how so, accidental
20:27:16 <lady-3jane> I was trying to remove it
20:27:33 <lady-3jane> figured out how, after autotweeting it again
20:27:40 <lady-3jane> that's like the fourth time I've posted that article
20:27:41 <lady-3jane> :>
20:29:44 <iceTwy> :p
20:30:31 <lady-3jane> It's worth posting 4 times, though.
20:30:42 <iceTwy> Yup
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22:52:49 <iceTwy> The Shawshank Redemption was well worth watching
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23:26:23 <Ari> oh, for sure
23:26:23 <Ari> great movie
23:29:49 <iceTwy> oh wow
23:30:05 <iceTwy> the ex-French-first-lady's website cost 410 000€
23:30:08 <iceTwy> to taxpayers
23:34:23 <iceTwy> Niiiiiice.
23:34:24 <iceTwy> http://arstechnica.com/security/2013/07/google-strengthens-android-security-muscle-with-nsa-developed-protection/
23:43:24 <waflel> HI
23:43:28 <waflel> ICETWY
23:43:33 <waflel> IS THIS IRC IPAD COMPATIBLE?
23:44:20 <iceTwy> what
23:44:26 <iceTwy> what irc
23:44:28 <iceTwy> waflel: ^
23:44:34 <waflel> IDK
23:45:27 <iceTwy> you fine bro?
23:56:50 <waflel> hjl